On this episode of Democracy Talk, Donna talks with City Councilor Diana Perez about her background and experience in the US Forest Service and with Doge, as well as life on the border in El Paso and the Hispanic community in Clark County. She is then joined by Carmen Paniagua, sister-in-law ofJosé Paniagua Calderón whose December 4th detention by ICE has gone viral, inspiring protests and support throughout Vancouver and online. Carmen shares the family’s struggle in dealing with their beloved little brother’s rough arrest and rapid removal first to Tacoma and then El Paso.